Episode 4 - Brain-Body Disconnect
& Text Based Communication
w/ Julie Sando (Part 2)

Show Notes

 Erin: Can you share a little bit about what you're offering now. Where people can come and learn more and maybe get some more training? 

Julie: We have a three step process at Autistically Inclined. So there's Sprout, Grow, and Flourish. So Sprout is all about mindset. We talked about kind of with step one, it's so important to have that mindset shift of,  I'm going to be talking to you differently. I'm going to start helping you understand what's happening with your brain and your body in this disconnect.

It's a whole way of thinking that is the place to start. So that's why Sprout is nine different mindsets. And it's great because  it's kind of like a podcast.  They're videos that you can listen to the audio and just have it on while you're doing the dishes . And you're just seeping in this different way of thinking that is life changing.

So that's Sprout. 

If this is your first time learning about the brain body disconnect, start there. Because  in order for you to be  quote unquote successful in this kind of communication, you've got to have the right kind of mindset. And I'll be honest,  even now when I feel myself getting kind of like a funk or going back to my old ways, I'll listen to or I'll watch one of those videos to kind of just recalibrate my brain.

We all ebb and flow through how we're thinking and feeling. And maybe we're not going to be in that mindset all the time, but I want to be there more often than not. So being able to come back to it is so important. It's huge. And it, and it doesn't feel, it's not something that feels overwhelming.

Erin: It feels really empowering listening to it, which is awesome.

Julie: Yeah Right.  Like 10 minute little clips to feed your brain and help motivate and inspire you. Love it.

Erin: And it flows over into other parts of your life too. I feel like, like that mindset, it's not just great just with, you know, like our loved ones, but it's great for life in general. Like it's an approach I feel like I totally adopted. Yes.

We got the mindset. We got Sprout.  Let's say, okay. Okay. My mindset. It's getting good. It's getting good. So now what's next?

Julie: Next up is Grow. So this is growing your everyday actions. So this really goes along nicely with what we talked about with  our two step process. Working on that purposeful movement. It's such a great foundation for getting to work on communication. So this Grow gives you nine everyday actions that you can take in your life.

Different ways that you can connect with your loved one and help them become more purposeful in life.  A lot of times when people think about starting this communication journey, it's overwhelming. How do we even get from point A to point B, let alone Z, right?

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That's overwhelming. So Grow is really great at   taking that pressure off and giving you things that you can incorporate into your day to day life. So that example of passing the remote.  Those everyday things that you can do that also help to rebuild trust and connection. Because like you were saying, Erin,  a lot of trust has been broken with our kids. And so we want to make sure that we connect first, then communicate, connect, communicate, connect, communicate.

So this is all the mindset of Sprout, and the everyday actions in Grow, are really fostering that connection piece first.

Erin:  That's so important because I know when you first start with the letterboard for some people things kind of happen a little bit more quickly as far as them being able to  really have good purposeful motor and being able to  share more openly on the letter board.  For some people that comes really quick, but then there's those of us ,  it's a longer process.

 And I think that  why not get the most out of the journey as you can. Why not use that as an opportunity to connect? You know what I mean? There's so many times when me and Noa will sit down for a session  when I'm like, he's gonna do X, Y, Z.  And when I come with like that tight grip,  nothing gets done. It feels yucky, not much progress is made. But if I come in and I'm like, you know what,  I have this one thing I want to focus on or this small goal I want to reach. And I'm going to be so happy if we do, but if we don't just the fact that we showed up and we, we try to get practice in.

 It's going to be good. And I always try to share whatever my intention is  at the beginning. To share with Noa, but also to remind myself, because I need the reminder and it  helps me focus.  But then those are the times that  me and Noa feel more connected and we make more progress.

And so I think  starting with a solid foundation of the mindset, building on that with that trust, that connection.  Those are such, such  essential layers to be more  successful. I don't know if successful is the right word, but being able to get the most out of  this journey through text based communication.

Because I honestly feel like even if we never got   to fully open conversational open communication. The journey has been worth it because oh, damn it. I'm gonna cry again.  Um, How much because I feel like I've always been connected to Noa we're really close  But it's taken us to like, a whole, a whole other level.

And so, yes, I'm so grateful.  Woo! Sorry. And I know that was long winded.

love every word. But so, but so meaningful. Like it, it means so much more. You know? 

Julie: Yes. 

Erin: It's gonna help me feel better because essentially I want him to be able to go do things on his own, to be able to communicate on his own, all these things. And it, it just feels better to me like we're connected.  We understand each other more and  to let him flourish right out there. 

 Julie: This is so hugely important, Erin.  People may see success stories online, you know, they read books or blogs or whatever, and they just see the end results and they don't see all the work that went into it to get to that point.  Some people do have a faster journey and some people have a slower journey and  it's so easy for people to look at and compare themselves to the people who might have a faster time and then to feel discouraged. But I think what you're saying is so huge and it takes that pressure off, right? There's so much pressure to be able to reach a really big goal. 

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And so  if you can come back to that mindset of enjoying the journey and like recognizing all that you're getting out of it, it takes the pressure off and you start to see how life changing it is, even though you haven't gotten to that  huge goal yet. Right? 

Erin: Right. We've got the mindset. Our connection is solid.  I'm ready to jump into learning this communication piece. Tell me about it. 

Julie: So flourish is, um, and when you're in Flourish, you also get access to Sprout and Grow, so you can just jump straight to Flourish and do the parts that feel good. Right. Um, from strut and go, so Flourish.  Oh,  so we used to do a nine month program. That's what Erin was talking about. That has a start and an end, and there's a value in that for sure. 

And what we saw is that  sometimes during that nine months for some families, life gets crazy.  And also let's say you've done that nine months, there's still support that's needed. This is an ongoing process that's always changing and growing. So you're at a different start point every several months.

 So everybody just needs ongoing support. Support needs don't end in autism. Right? So we created this monthly, really affordable  membership  so that we can be with you for the long run and hold your hand. And when life gets full or overwhelming, you pause that membership and you come back when you're ready.

We're in it for the long haul with you so that we can be with you through those ups and downs. And also when life gets crazy, sometimes that's when you need the community the most, Right.  

Erin: Right. And that's one  thing. I think I touched on it in that first episode. But that community piece is everything. And I feel like even if you just jumped to Flourish and you never did the Sprout and Grow,  although you should, I'm just saying, so you have a good foundation, but if you didn't,   the Flourish program, it has like everything embedded in it because you get support and learning the actual skills to communicate.

  But then also embedded in there is a communication coaching call. So if you have questions, you can come and you can ask your specific questions.  But it's open to like, if there's things that you need to share, like you're experiencing a lot of dysregulation because that's tied to  the ability to communicate more efficiently.

  We can talk about that. And there's something that's so,  validating  that when I come and I share that it's been a really hard week and I'm not sure how to address this dysregulation. And then another member of our community is like, Oh my gosh, I've been going through that too, or that happened to me last month, but you know what?

I tried this. You might want to try it. There's something so  connecting about that. I feel like sometimes  it's like, you know, when you go to church and you  refill your cup and you're  ready to go, that's what it's like for me. And I think for a lot of families  especially in our community. I know most parents  that I talk to,  even though they want community and they value it, they don't always  make the effort to get it  because we feel like we've got to focus on our kids.  Don't worry about us.

Like, we'll be good. We got to focus on our kids,  but we've got to be good so that when we are focusing on them, that we're giving fully. Right. And so it, it helps to have that community piece kind of built into the program because you need it. Even on the days that I feel like, oh, I'm good. When we're they're sharing. It fills me up for sure. 

Julie: Yeah,  it's so true. Every month you can have that consistent time set aside to focus on you and your needs and how to help your son or daughter or the person you're working with, right? We've got parents, professionals, anybody in this group.  How to help them move forward in their communication skills.

Erin: You also have a call where you do video feedback. Do you want to tell us about that? 

Julie: It helps because sometimes explaining it and actually seeing it are two totally different things. Because there's things that in the moment you don't know what could be happening. And so you can pick an area where you're stuck or where you have a question,  record yourself.  doing your spelling practice.

You upload your video, submit it to the group, and we watch each other's videos and we comment like, wow, you did this piece really good. Or, oh, I noticed that this was kind of happening.  I wonder if that might be where the breakdown is or whatever. So we can share that way. And then we do a call once a month where we're sharing the videos and we're talking about them. And we have. Kate, who is amazing. So much experience,  all the things like she, she's amazing.  She'll coach us through. Like, you know what, this is a strategy that I think is worth trying. It's so great at  really helping you address specifically your individual needs or questions. That video feedback is, that in itself is  gold.

It's nice to be able to, like you said, with the communication partner coaching call. When you're hearing other people and relating to other people, you learn so much too. So you're getting to watch other people's videos and hear their feedback. And that's nice about that, right? Ah, the pressure's not on me.

Like it's nice to, to have it. And then to also have  the ability to hear other people and  let them process. And you gain so much from that too. 

yes and another huge piece of the program too, I think is the group lesson  because you're getting the practice in.  But what  I think is the most cool is like, we're talking about, we want to connect,  sorry, I'm probably going to cry again. Let me just get my tissue. 

  📍 Oh God.  But I think about, I know,  give me that box.  But I think about how isolated and lonely,   like I think about my Noa for so long, like, I just want to feel like I belong. And I know especially like at the camp, and we could talk about the camp. The camp's like a whole, we could do days talking about that camp.

It's flippin' amazing. But  even in spelling in the group lesson,  there's times when some of the,  more open ended  spellers are able to share different things.  Somebody shared once about how it feels being dysregulated, but how it feels so great to be here. To be understood, to feel seen, to feel like they belong.

And when  Kate was reading that response, the way that Noa looked at the screen,  I was just like, Oh my God.  Yeah. Cause I feel it. And if I feel it this much, I can't even imagine how much it's impacting him. So it gives him a chance to connect and feel like I'm not the only one because I'm sure there's moments that he feels like that.

Those lessons are just like we're feeding his brain, giving him age appropriate material. We're practicing communication, practicing purposeful motor. We're getting to be in community. I am as a parent and he is as  an individual  who's experiencing something on a different level.

 It's huge. It's so impactful. 

  📍 It is. And some parents might be thinking, my son can't match his colors. He doesn't know this. He doesn't show me, like age appropriate material?  My son's not ready for that. He hasn't been exposed to any of this. And I just want to say  if anybody's having that thought,  that's what the brain body disconnect has taught us, that  they have no issues with listening. 

They have challenges with showing their listening in ways that make sense to you and I, because that's how we show we're listening.

He's sitting there taking it all in, all these years. If they have siblings, they're listening to the siblings and  what they're learning. They're watching shows sometimes have captions.

They're teaching people how to read . A lot of our kids know so much more than they're able to show us. They have figured out as they get older, how to read  a lot of different things. And this process, what we teach you in the course materials and Flourish, is also how to help them along in that process

when they get stuck. When they don't know.  We're not presuming knowledge. We're presuming competence. We're not presuming that they just automatically know everything, but we're presuming that they're capable of learning and that they've been listening. All these years and that they're able to learn.

So we teach to that level.  

Yes.

 One of the biggest challenges I hear from parents is accountability.  They have good intentions. They want to be able to do all the things, but getting it to happen, starting, right, all those things,

it's hard when you're managing a household. When you're keeping kids alive. When you're, you know, all the things on your plate. So we know how important accountability is. And so we have the world's  best accountability coach.  We do.  Her name is Erin. She is right here with us right now. So we can actually talk to her about this accountability call.

And so once a month, you get to schedule a 30 minute accountability call with Erin, where  she helps you get clear on what are your goals this month. And here's some steps that you can do to reach those goals. And then she'll check in with you the next month. And if you didn't get to it, that's okay.

She's there to help you readjust so that you can be successful. So it is my favorite part. Do you want to tell us more  about that experience that you have as a accountability coach?  

  📍  📍  I mean, you explained it so well. I get to meet with parents, which I love.  We all have  some months we're like, yes, we're doing all the things. And the next month it feels like we fall off. 

  But life happens and being able to have somebody tell you, you know what, it's okay. It happens to all of us. Kind of helps take some of  that pressure we put on ourselves off and be like, okay, it happened. So how do we plan for that moving forward?

So powerful about that coming from a fellow parent who lives it, right? Rather than for me as a professional. You should be doing X, Y, and Z.  

Yeah, yeah, because I've experienced all of it.  Even as an accountability coach, I'm real and I'm human and I go through all of the ebbs and flows of life. And so I get it. And so sometimes me, helping other people, it really helps me too. And sometimes I'm like, wait, was this for you?

Or it was for me. Because I've gotten so much value out of it. But I love it.  I love connecting with all the other parents and watching them on their journey and watching them grow.  I love the whole Flourish program. You've done such a beautiful job in incorporating, like, every piece.

It's not just skill based. There's so much. And what I think sets you apart from maybe other   programs would be the flexibility.  I've learned in my own life through  experiences with Noa and even life in general. There's no one size fits all for anything because everybody's so different.

I cannot tell you how many times as a professional,  it just feels so wrong to be  taught that this is the one right way. And then a parent who lives this. Comes and says, well, from my experience, da, da, da, da, da. And then the program that we're trained in says, well, that's wrong. Because that doesn't line up with what  we're teaching.

 It gets under my skin in the biggest way. Who have been in those situations for years and years and years where I have to,  as part of this program, say that's not valid to a parent. That's not cool, right?  That is that parent's lived experience and there is so much value in that. So  one,  we need to value what parents have experienced as professionals. 

Two, I love what you said, Erin, when you're being an accountability coach for somebody else, it's helping you also have accountability in yourself. And it's similar, like in these communication partner coaching calls and the video feedback calls, when it's just   you guys without your kids and you're talking. You see parents helping other parents.  And that's helping both of them, right? It's just, it's a beautiful community. It's a way that. we can all come together and support each other and value each other and put our minds together.  And so we're not going to tell anybody anything is wrong. We're going to tell you, try it and learn from it.

And then we'll find out how it was in this moment for your kid. And that might not even be a reflection of how it is the next time you try it. Right? Try it several times. Let's really learn. 

 And I think that's a piece that could be valuable in so many approaches.  That's one thing, like, now that  I look for in people.  Like you're knowledgeable in whatever it is that you're focusing on supporting us with.

But you're also open to the idea that there are other ways. There are other things that can be embedded within what you're doing to make it more effective for me specifically. You know what I mean?  That's a, that's such a big piece. And I've definitely learned to listen to my gut. Like,  this doesn't feel quite right.

Like I remember feeling like that when Noa was young.  But this is what they're telling me. The experts are saying this is it. So I'm trusting it. And not saying that it's all wrong, but maybe it's not  like the only way, you know, 

right, right.  When you have that sense of freedom to try something and learn from it or not or not.  That's life changing for parents. 

And I think too,   say you join Flourish , Don't just start off doing your own thing. Like you want to give the framework a chance because  that's been helpful for a majority of people.

It's not to be  dismissed. There's reason behind it. And I think it's worth giving it a, giving it a shot.  And then from there, okay.  Like part of it's maybe working, but there's a piece over here that feels a little, so then we can look at that specifically, you know,  because, I mean, Julie and Kate have a vast amount of experience working with all kinds of different people at different levels, different body control, all the things.

And so, what you're experiencing, they might have experienced that with somebody else, and they can be like, you know what? Something similar happened to somebody else I worked with and this kind of helped. And so,  try it and then go from there for 

Yeah. It's a balance, right? 

  📍 That's the gist of Flourish. There's so, 

much more.  We have Flourish Lite. We have Flourish Plus, so that you can come in at different levels and try it out. Flourish Plus has Story Club with Jake, which is amazing.

There's just all sorts of different supports to be able to, practice communication in a fun way.

We're all about relationships and connection. That's our foundation.  That's my starting point. And so Jake does our Story Club. There's a great group that gets together a few times a month in different ways. And again, there's flexibility.  There's different ways that he has for people to participate.

If you're not able to come to the Zoom part, because Zoom is hard, there's ways for you to participate where you don't have to be using Zoom.  

  📍 Yeah, Really meeting people where they're at on all the different levels.  And, and that Story Club is so good. You can even just join that if you wanted to.  

 Be successful and to have fun. 

shows like how much  you're here to serve the community.  I feel like everything that you do,  I feel that from you.  

  📍  I'm sure you've heard me talk about the camp and you're going to continue to hear me talking about this camp.  So  Julie's been  a Family Spellers Camp for two years,  I've attended every single camp. And every single time it's like magic.   And I think sometimes people think that I'm exaggerating but then they experience and they're like, oh my god, can we start a community and live here. Because it feels like, especially for those of us who have,  who have a loved one who has a really hard body.

  📍 And it's hard for them to  go out and do things in just the typical community. To just be able to be and to not be, Oh, sorry. Oh, sorry. Oh, sorry. Like all, all the damn time.  No, like you can be and somebody walks by and they get a slap on the leg. Like nobody even  bats an eye, right? If anything, they're like, Hey, what's up?

Like, yeah, I see you too. You know what I mean? People are treated like they're whatever age they are, whether they're 12 or 21 or 35. Like,  yeah, it's,  it's so incredible. And I just.  Experience it if you can. 

  📍 Yes. Yes. This last time we had a seven year old and a 30  something year old.  So that was our age range.   How is this going to be?  It's the most beautiful thing.  One of the things we did was,  we have lots of different activities. People can choose from at different points.

So one of the activities people could choose was to come and have a conversation.  And so there was a seven year old and this 30 something year old. , another young adult who was 20. A couple of them and hearing this 35 year old share with a seven year old,  it gets better. It gets easier.

Like hang in there. I know it's hard, you know, and having that seven year old be able to hear that and to be able to be a 35 year old and express that to somebody, like, it's just so healing  for everybody on so many levels. 

Yeah. Dang. Yeah. To hear it from somebody who's lived it, not from their mom, not from the professional, say, you know, what's going to get better. It's going to, no, but somebody who's lived it and yeah. Like how healing for him to be able to like all, all this that I've experienced, like  I can use it  to, Oh, for something good.

So I can, Oh, it's so good. Yes. 

  📍 How impactful for those people who have autism,  who are using the text based communication.  But even for the other family members, it's giving parents a chance to connect with other parents and families that are like theirs.

Which is huge. We don't feel judged. We feel seen. We feel validated. And it's like, we want to support each other. We want the best for each other. And to be in that space and the energy, it's,  it feels so good. Like afterwards you're like, yes, people exist who are supportive, you know? And then even like my daughter, she's neurotypical.

And she loves going to camp. She loves to be able to connect with other siblings because they're like her. They're, they're experiencing both worlds.  And I'm sure they have lots of different feelings but they can get together and they can share and they can have fun together. But then she also loves coming and supporting in some kind of way, interacting with other spellers.

You don't only have to connect with people who use text based communication, you can also connect with me too, you know? And so, yeah, every time at the end of camp, we're like, we're also filled up. 

  📍 It's so beautiful to see your daughter Ailana like step up

in such a big way. To be an advocate for the family members and for her brother and for others.   She has been so instrumental in helping create the connections that happen between siblings and finding ways for them to be able to have some time together.

So she's, she's amazing. I love her. 

   📍 For the Flourish program, for the camp, there are funding sources. So if you're at home thinking, how in the world would I pay for this? Like, it sounds great. It sounds fantastic, but how do I even do it?  Depending on where you live,  there are options available and you can always reach out to Julie, to me, and we can help you however we can.

Because I just feel like,  especially this communication piece, it can open up,  a whole other world, a whole other world. 

Yeah,  

  📍 Yes. I feel like it's so easy for people to latch on to like, Oh, my kid won't do Zoom. Oh, I can't afford that. 

I don't have time to do all the things in Flourish.  And here's the thing. There's a way. There's always a way,  Don't let that stop you.

Communication is too important to latch on to that one thing. So talk to us about that one thing. We're not going to be salesy and like force you to do this and get this down your throat. That's not our end goal. Our end goal is to hear, okay, what do you have going on in life? How can we adapt or adjust or connect you with some resources or right to make it feel more doable for your reality. 

 Flourish has so many things in it and just because it's there doesn't mean you have to do it all . That's what Erin was saying in her calls. She'll be like, Hey, take the pressure off of doing the group lessons. Just come to the communication partner coaching call and the video feedback. Like that's huge, 

It's so flexible. So no excuses, 

 Right, the flexibility is there. You can do all the things, or you can do a couple of the things, or none of the things, you know, it's up to you.  wherever you're at at the time. . See flexibility. It it's everywhere. It's needed everywhere. Yes. 

   📍 So,  like we've, we've talked about the communication, but I'm so curious if you can share with us, maybe somebody who didn't have access to communication early on in their life.  Then they were able to learn to communicate through this text based communication and how much their life has changed.

Like what did it look like before?  What does it look like now?  

  📍   I want to share about Jakob. And this is, this is great to share about because you can actually follow him on Facebook. It's Cards by Jakob, J A K O B. Follow him. They post So many videos, you can see it in action.  So, Jakob was 20 when he had his communication breakthrough.  And he started practicing, I want to say when he was like  18,  at somewhere in this age range, right?

 Before communication, he ate the same 20 foods for the first 20 years of his life, basically.  And they had to be very specific brands.  If they were traveling, they would pack coolers and coolers of food. They would have to go to the grocery store and buy, find the specific things. It was an ordeal.  He had to have them at certain times, like very rigid around food.  When he first started communicating his internal thoughts,   he shared he wanted to be able to try new foods. Now his mom was floored because  they had tried everything under the sun for 20 years.

His body protests.  So dysregulated.   His mom's like, I have no, like, no idea how to do this because we've tried everything. What do you mean?  This is the opposite of what I thought it was all these years. 

Right.

So we asked him, how do we help you?  Now this won't be everybody's answer, right? This was his answer.

His answer was  trick my body. My mind knows the truth, but my body needs to be tricked.  Tell me lies about why I need to  do this differently. 

Wow, how interesting.  

Right. Like, well, what does that look like? Well, his body, his outward appearance,  likes rules. Follows rules.

 It's a tricky science that his mom has mastered. So she starts making up rules like,  there's a federation that meets in the government every Friday that they come up with the new food rules for the country. And they said that everybody has to have meat with breakfast. Like it's a thing.  Does this mean his body's like, okay? No! His body is like, no, no foods, no new foods.

 His speaking voice is saying that. It's protesting still.  And she now knows she has to speak to the mind differently from how she speaks to the body.  So when she's speaking to the body, she is  speaking about these rules or throwing in some things like, hey, we're going to go to  this event that you really want to go to.

Well, they only serve this food there, right? It's a thing.  So she's talking to his body about these rules, but then she's also breaking it down into motor steps. She's coaching the motor.  In the beginning, this would take a long time. A new food would take a long time. Now it happens a lot faster for most foods.

And occasionally there's still some that take a long time.  She will slowly coach the motor while she's giving these rules. And then also,  she knows that the mind wants to do this, so that's why she's persistent. He has told her so she can have that fuel to be behind it. And since last August,  he has gone from 20 foods in his diet to over 200 foods 

Oh, wow. I didn't know it was that many. That's massive. 

Massive! Life  

Yeah. 

changing! Right? Thanks!  And they would have had no clue. They would have thought the opposite and stayed in that really challenging 20 foods that he actually didn't want,  If they didn't have communication. 

  📍 Wow. How freeing for him.  Wow.

And they post so many videos of him eating these new foods and trying them like go back on their Facebook page and watch some videos. 

Yeah. The videos are, are amazing. . So inspiring.  And he's an incredible young man. He's a business owner. He's about to be in a movie, like a real legit, like, Oh, all the things. He's, he's amazing. 

It's fun to follow. 

And you know what I think is really cool too? Like I know that I feel sometimes like do I push, do I not push? And being able for him to tell her like, no, I want this. Then she knows to push  and the way that she's pushing feels different than like I want it I'm gonna push versus he let me know he wants it and even though I wanted too, we're like we're co creating this.

You know what? I mean? 

It opens up the world, for our loved ones, for us, for, for the relationship between us, like how, oh, how expansive,  It's coming. I'm dreaming it. I'm manifesting. That's gonna ha it's gonna happen for me. Look, it's already it's already started opening, but 

It is. Noa is starting to tell us what goals he wants to work on when you offer him some choices. And that's huge. You can see him invest in that.

So this can look like so many different levels at different levels of communication. 

Yeah. Yeah.

And it's almost like it's not just the specific type of communication that opens up because I feel like since we've started, we've opened in so many ways.  

Noa's going to be sharing all his thoughts. Stay tuned everyone  

 I'm sure he's got some too. Because sometimes it's giving me that look like, Oh God, mom, 

Oh, I feel it. I feel it,  but it's okay. I will take it. I will take it.  

Yeah. Yeah.

It's, it's never as bad and scary. So many parents are scared of like, wow, what are they going to say? You know, what are they going to say? And these kids  and adults are the most  understanding and forgiving of other people. You know, the people's, you fears.  I don't see them come to light.

  But people that holds people back from jumping in fully. Because they're scared 

Yeah. Yeah.

they might hear. And Yeah. not everything's easy to hear, but it's so worth it and it's so life changing to be able to have this insight. Yes. 

   📍 And even if they do share something that's hard for us to hear,  I feel like us  maybe coming at it with the perspective of, , we need to release things and think about how freeing it is for us to just say something out loud. How does that feel for them? Like,  like for Jakob, 20 years of , I don't want to just keep eating the same thing, but I can't get my body to eat something.

Like how, how freeing?  I'm sure the mom, You know, his mom felt all this guilt, like, Oh my gosh,  I wish I would have just pushed. Or why didn't I think of this before? We all go through those things, but don't stay there.  It's gonna come, but let it come for a minute and pass.

And okay, so I'm going to move forward. What am I going to do now?  

  📍 I love so much about you. And then Jen, who's Jakob's mom, you both have such, a beautiful ability to keep it real. You're honest. You're not sugarcoating  

Also  you're inspiring and you persist and you have such a  valuable way of like a filter of how you see the world  and you don't always have that view.

It's like, you're not this perfect person who has it all together. Who's always in that space that it's just this beautiful balance of keeping it real. And also you're so inspiring.  

Thanks. 

Definitely not perfect, but I'm learning. And  I feel like I, I keep shedding another layer.  I'm getting a little better and a little better.  

There's beauty in that imperfection. And I think our kids have such a, you know, they're hard on themselves because they can't get their body and they're embarrassed about what their body does. Right. That's not how they want to be portrayed. And so they're hard on themselves. So when we are able to be human, be raw, be messy,  it models to them how to move through that with grace as well. 

Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. 

 During our conversation, I think you've done such a good job at  giving people  ideas about where to start, like brain body disconnect mindset and building on that.   But what about if there's somebody who's completely new to the community, like they're suspecting that their child might have autism or that they're just getting a diagnosis. Is there,  like a message or  something you'd like to guide parents to.

 What would you say to somebody who's newly diagnosed?

  📍  I think having them start with Sprout and Grow would be so valuable because it sets your mindset from the beginning. Which is life changing. Uh, literally path changing, right? 

Save so much time, so much time unlearning. 

Yes! Yes, exactly, avoid all that! Skip it.

 And Grow , is great for all ages.  Whether you're 2 or 12 or 40 or 80, it's good human ways of interacting. So this is going to give you tools to be able to interact with your loved one, whether they're neurotypical or not, whether they're neurodiverse or not.

 So start there.  And many people ask too,  is my child too young? What if they're 4? 

Start this young, right? So, one, many kids are hyperlexic.  In our community, which means they're, they just have a natural ability to, you know, they're lining up the alphabet already. When they're 2 they're spelling words. 

I so some people are like that. Some people are not like that. You don't hear anything. There's no speech. There's no apparent interest.  No matter where your child is on that spectrum,  you can still teach. You can still expose them and trust that it's going in. So expose them to the age appropriate content for their age.

And this will save you  so much in the long run. So there are things you can do. And I've had students who start the spelling and communication journey at four.  We're giving them the opportunity to make a choice. And we can do that by integrating pictures and words and choices on a whiteboard or holding up the two objects.

This is all working on purposeful communication. Helping them form  that point.  I mean, there's a thousand things you can do when your kid is two 

We're even developing a program for the littles, so stay tuned. 

  📍 Oh, I can't wait. So when that's coming  to completion, we're going to bring you back on to share more about that because that's huge.  As more and more people are learning about  the brain body disconnect and understanding there's so much more to people who have autism that are non speaking or minimally speaking or doing repetitive things  or their body on the outside, it looks like maybe they're not understanding at the depth  that now we know that they are.

I feel like more and more people are going to be wanting to start younger. I feel like a lot of people are maybe teens or adults who are  understanding that later in life.   That's my goal to spread the word.  Don't wait until later. If you don't have to, why not start young? Why not open up those doors when they're little?

   📍 How many times I hear people say,   I want to do everything I can to get speech first. So, I'm going to invest fully in that.  There's these myths out there that if you work on text based communication or AAC or  any alternative forms of communication that that's going to hinder speech. 

This could not be farther from the truth. We're giving access to  multiple ways for them to get their thoughts out. Do we only get our thoughts out in one way? No. Because I speak, does that hinder my ability to text somebody? No.  Does that hinder my ability to find other ways to communicate? No, it adds to my ability to communicate.

I'm not always able to get my thoughts out through speaking.

There's times when I'm dysregulated and that's not my best mode of communication. So why are we limiting our kids? This is not going to hinder speech. This is going to give them more confidence, more options, more ways to get their thoughts out.

 What we hear over and over and over is. Wow, my kids started talking more when we gave them access to other forms of communication. 

  📍  I feel like Noa says more, and there's even times when we're practicing, and, we're spelling a word and his body's stuck and I hear him whisper the letter. And , it's the right letter. And I'm just like, man, oh, you're thinking it like, what an example. Like you're thinking it like,  it's just coaching that body to get there.

 I think it supports communication as a whole.  It doesn't make sense to me why you think that it wouldn't. 

  So my final question, , since you've been part of  the autism community, if there's, I'm sure there's a million ways that you've grown through being part of this community.

I know for me, it's. Oh God, all the levels, all the things. But maybe something that stands out how you've grown through being part of the autism community. Yes, I love  

this question. I think the biggest, most freeing, valuable thing I have learned is that  I am never done learning. I've had many experiences where I thought, Oh, this is it. 

I thought ABA was it when I was 20 years old. .

There was another program I learned and I thought, that was it, awesome, this is what I'm going to do for the rest of my life.

Nope.  Then there's Natural Play Therapy that I created. Oh, this is awesome. Of course, this is what I'm going to do the rest of my life. Communication,  awesome, this is what I'm going to do the rest of my life. No, I don't know what's next, but it's always growing and expanding when we understand that we are never done learning, and we embrace that. 

That's so good. It's like there's never really an end because there's always more. There's always more to grow into. 

What's next? Can you even imagine? 

Right. Right.  Oh, I love it.  Okay. So if people want to  learn more about Flourish, about what you're doing,  even just follow you to stay connected with you.

 What are the best places to learn more?

I love it. So the first step would be go to autisticallyinclined. com. There's two things you can do there. We've got a quick start guide. Where you can learn how to get started right away, and we also have an opportunity for you to set up a call with  somebody who can help you  figure out what might be the best fit for you, if you're unsure.  And then also follow us on social media. We are on Facebook. We are on Instagram.  Always sharing good stuff there. So follow us. 

Yes. Yes. And I'll make sure that I include all of the links and   your Instagram handle and Facebook handle. So you'll be able to access that if you're watching or listening.

Throw in Communication for Education. com too. We didn't even talk about that. My goodness. 

Good things  over at Communication for Education through Facebook and Instagram as well.  

Especially if you're interested in learning about or hearing what autistic people have to say and what they're thinking and how they perceive things. Things that they've been wanting to share. Follow them because  it's not like I'm interpreting what they're saying, or  it's just what Julie thinks about what's going on.

No, this is directly from them. It's so, oh, it's so powerful. It's so good. 

Yes! 

So good. 

what it's all about! so 

Yep. Yep. Yep. 

loved every 

it was so good talking to you, Julie. Thank you so much. All right.